<html><head><meta http-equiv="Content-Type" content="text/html; charset=utf-8"></head><body style="word-wrap: break-word; -webkit-nbsp-mode: space; line-break: after-white-space;" class="">Hi all,<div class=""><br class=""></div><div class="">We heard back from EOS and they want to know more. See below. In our meeting tomorrow, I would like to briefly discuss our response.</div><div class=""><br class=""></div><div class=""><div class="">cheers,</div><div class=""><br class=""></div><div class="">-m. </div><div><br class=""><blockquote type="cite" class=""><div class="">Begin forwarded message:</div><br class="Apple-interchange-newline"><div style="margin-top: 0px; margin-right: 0px; margin-bottom: 0px; margin-left: 0px;" class=""><span style="font-family: -webkit-system-font, Helvetica Neue, Helvetica, sans-serif; color:rgba(0, 0, 0, 1.0);" class=""><b class="">From: </b></span><span style="font-family: -webkit-system-font, Helvetica Neue, Helvetica, sans-serif;" class="">eos <<a href="mailto:eos@agu.org" class="">eos@agu.org</a>><br class=""></span></div><div style="margin-top: 0px; margin-right: 0px; margin-bottom: 0px; margin-left: 0px;" class=""><span style="font-family: -webkit-system-font, Helvetica Neue, Helvetica, sans-serif; color:rgba(0, 0, 0, 1.0);" class=""><b class="">Subject: </b></span><span style="font-family: -webkit-system-font, Helvetica Neue, Helvetica, sans-serif;" class=""><b class="">[External] Query on your Eos proposal - Mark Parsons</b><br class=""></span></div><div style="margin-top: 0px; margin-right: 0px; margin-bottom: 0px; margin-left: 0px;" class=""><span style="font-family: -webkit-system-font, Helvetica Neue, Helvetica, sans-serif; color:rgba(0, 0, 0, 1.0);" class=""><b class="">Date: </b></span><span style="font-family: -webkit-system-font, Helvetica Neue, Helvetica, sans-serif;" class="">July 7, 2021 at 6:35:53 AM MDT<br class=""></span></div><div style="margin-top: 0px; margin-right: 0px; margin-bottom: 0px; margin-left: 0px;" class=""><span style="font-family: -webkit-system-font, Helvetica Neue, Helvetica, sans-serif; color:rgba(0, 0, 0, 1.0);" class=""><b class="">To: </b></span><span style="font-family: -webkit-system-font, Helvetica Neue, Helvetica, sans-serif;" class="">"<a href="mailto:map0046@uah.edu" class="">map0046@uah.edu</a>" <<a href="mailto:map0046@uah.edu" class="">map0046@uah.edu</a>><br class=""></span></div><br class=""><div class=""><meta charset="UTF-8" class=""><div class="WordSection1" style="page: WordSection1; caret-color: rgb(0, 0, 0); font-family: Helvetica; font-size: 12px; font-style: normal; font-variant-caps: normal; font-weight: normal; letter-spacing: normal; text-align: start; text-indent: 0px; text-transform: none; white-space: normal; word-spacing: 0px; -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px; text-decoration: none;"><p class="MsoNormal" style="margin: 0in 0in 12pt; font-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif;"><span style="font-family: "Libre Franklin";" class="">Dear Dr. Parsons,<o:p class=""></o:p></span></p><p class="MsoNormal" style="margin: 0in 0in 12pt; font-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif;"><span style="font-family: "Libre Franklin";" class="">Thank you for submitting your proposal on “Film credits for science.”<br class=""><br class="">We have reviewed your proposal; however, one of the Reviewers had some concerns we'd like to address before we proceed. <o:p class=""></o:p></span></p><p class="MsoNormal" style="margin: 0in 0in 12pt; font-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif;"><span style="font-family: "Libre Franklin";" class="">Please read the<span class="Apple-converted-space"> </span><span style="background-color: yellow;" class="">comments in highlight</span><span class="Apple-converted-space"> </span>below and reply to this email with a brief response. Once we receive your response, we’ll expedite the review and have a decision for you shortly. <o:p class=""></o:p></span></p><p class="MsoNormal" style="margin: 0in 0in 12pt; font-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif;"><i class=""><span style="font-family: "Libre Franklin";" class="">Eos<br class=""><br class=""></span></i><span style="font-family: "Libre Franklin";" class="">_______________________________ <o:p class=""></o:p></span></p><div style="margin: 0in; font-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif;" class=""><b class=""><span style="font-family: "Libre Franklin";" class="">Reviewer #1 Comments:<span class="Apple-converted-space"> </span></span></b><span style="font-family: "Libre Franklin";" class=""> <o:p class=""></o:p></span></div><div style="margin: 0in; font-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif;" class=""><span style="font-family: "Libre Franklin";" class=""><o:p class=""> </o:p></span></div><div style="margin: 0in; font-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif;" class=""><span style="font-family: "Libre Franklin";" class="">The authors propose a brief description about a new initiative to increase the visibility and impact of Earth science data sets and data products. This has been a big issue over the years in my field and many people do feel that their data products (e.g., a catalog of earthquake locations and sizes) are undervalued in the research community. The assignment of DOIs to data centers and data sets has alleviated this a little, however at the end of the day the onus falls on journal editors to enforce citation to relevant data products. I think the battle is being won, but it is progressing very slowly. Anyway, I would be interested in reading a short update on this issue as proposed by the authors. The good news is it would apply to all sections with AGU; the bad news is that will mainly be interesting to practicing scientists and won't have as big an impact on the broader Eos readership of the Earth science interested public.<o:p class=""></o:p></span></div><div style="margin: 0in; font-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif;" class=""><span style="font-family: "Libre Franklin";" class=""><o:p class=""> </o:p></span></div><div style="margin: 0in; font-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif;" class=""><b class=""><span style="font-family: "Libre Franklin";" class="">Reviewer #2 Comments:<span class="Apple-converted-space"> </span></span></b><span style="font-family: "Libre Franklin";" class=""> <o:p class=""></o:p></span></div><div style="margin: 0in; font-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif;" class=""><span style="font-family: "Libre Franklin";" class=""><o:p class=""> </o:p></span></div><p class="MsoNormal" style="margin: 0in 0in 12pt; font-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif;"><span style="font-family: "Libre Franklin";" class="">The idea of implementing alternative structures or means to offer credit and recognize contributions in science is intriguing and, other than one or two articles making a case for improved citation of data sets that we’ve featured, isn’t something we’ve covered in depth recently. So I generally like this proposal despite, as Reviewer #1 points out, that it may be of limited interest to non-scientists. <o:p class=""></o:p></span></p><p class="MsoNormal" style="margin: 0in 0in 12pt; font-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif;"><span style="font-family: "Libre Franklin"; background-color: yellow;" class="">However, I’d suggest going back to the authors to ask for some elaboration on what they are proposing as far as workable alternatives to current approaches for designating authorship, credit, etc., or at least as first steps to begin coming up with alternatives. (If they’re just pointing out a problem without offering any potential solutions, I don’t think Eos is the right venue.) They say that the “ESIP Citation Cluster advocates a new way to think about the roles and credit for all the people involved in producing useful scientific artifacts,” but it’s not clear what this new way entails—other than perhaps that it uses the film credit analogy as a starting point. Can they give more information so we know more about what their article would look like?</span><span style="font-family: "Libre Franklin";" class=""> <o:p class=""></o:p></span></p><div style="margin: 0in; font-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif;" class=""><span style="font-family: "Libre Franklin";" class="">If they do have alternative approaches or ideas to offer, I also think it’ll be important in a potential article to<span class="Apple-converted-space"> </span><span style="background-color: yellow;" class="">acknowledge if there are possible drawbacks.</span><span class="Apple-converted-space"> </span>For instance, much as film credits can drag on for many minutes (and surely must take a lot of time and effort to compile in their own right), I can imagine such credit listings (e.g., for a published article) could become quite lengthy and involve significant time to assemble depending on how widely credit is extended. <o:p class=""></o:p></span></div><div style="margin: 0in; font-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif;" class=""><span style="font-family: "Libre Franklin";" class=""><o:p class=""> </o:p></span></div><div style="margin: 0in; font-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif;" class=""><span style="font-family: "Libre Franklin";" class="">_______________________________ </span><span style="font-family: "Libre Franklin";" class=""><o:p class=""></o:p></span></div><h3 style="margin-right: 0in; margin-left: 0in; font-size: 13.5pt; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif;" class=""><span style="font-size: 11pt; font-family: "Libre Franklin";" class="">Parsons Mark<span class="Apple-converted-space"> </span><o:p class=""></o:p></span></h3><div style="margin: 0in; font-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif;" class=""><strong class=""><span style="font-family: "Libre Franklin";" class="">Affiliation:</span></strong><span style="font-family: "Libre Franklin";" class=""><br class="">University of Alabama in Huntsville<span class="Apple-converted-space"> </span><br class=""><br class=""><strong class=""><span style="font-family: "Libre Franklin";" class="">email:</span></strong><br class=""><a href="mailto:map0046@uah.edu" target="_blank" style="color: rgb(5, 99, 193); text-decoration: underline;" class="">map0046@uah.edu</a><br class=""><br class=""><strong class=""><span style="font-family: "Libre Franklin";" class="">Coauthors:</span></strong><br class="">Madison Langseth, USGS<span class="Apple-converted-space"> </span><br class=""><br class=""><strong class=""><span style="font-family: "Libre Franklin";" class="">Content type:</span></strong><br class="">Opinion<br class=""><br class=""><strong class=""><span style="font-family: "Libre Franklin";" class="">Proposed title:</span></strong><br class="">Film credits for science<br class=""><br class=""><strong class=""><span style="font-family: "Libre Franklin";" class="">Topic(s):</span></strong><br class="">Informatics, scholarly communication and credit<br class=""><br class=""><strong class=""><span style="font-family: "Libre Franklin";" class="">Reviewer preference</span></strong><br class="">Kirk Martinez<br class=""><br class=""><strong class=""><span style="font-family: "Libre Franklin";" class="">Key points:</span></strong><br class="">Credit is the currency of science. This has traditionally been primarily done through citation but also through awards and various other means informal and informal, including the names of geo features, instruments, methods, etc. There is increasing recognition that roles need to be more-clearly specified (e.g. the Contributor Roles Taxonomy--CRediT) and that research artifacts other than articles also deserve credit (data, code, methods...). It is important to credit people for all kinds of work and products in science, but that’s difficult. Citation is only one mechanism because there are different roles which need to be credited differently for different artifacts. It can actually get quite complex. The analogy of film credits is often used: Key roles listed at the beginning of the movie and numerous supporting roles listed at the end. What may not be evident is that the order, prominence, and categories of these roles come from a highly negotiated, complex process involving agents, unions, contracts, etc. Can we do something similar for science but simpler? The ESIP Citation Cluster advocates a new way to think about the roles and credit for all the people involved in producing useful scientific artifacts. We need a fuller and more formal method for recognizing appropriate roles in the production of all first-class research objects.<span class="Apple-converted-space"> </span><br class=""><br class=""><strong class=""><span style="font-family: "Libre Franklin";" class="">Article's importance to<span class="Apple-converted-space"> </span><i class="">Eos</i><span class="Apple-converted-space"> </span>readers</span></strong><br class="">In the era of open science, people deserve to be credited for all their intellectual contributions. AGU has begun to recognize this with the use of CRediT for journal articles and the growing requirement for data and software citation, but the issue is even more complex.<br class=""><br class=""><strong class=""><span style="font-family: "Libre Franklin";" class="">Broader impacts:</span></strong><br class="">Open science requires greater recognition for all contributions not just papers.<br class=""><br class=""><strong class=""><span style="font-family: "Libre Franklin";" class="">Employer review required?</span></strong><br class="">No<span class="Apple-converted-space"> </span></span></div></div></div></blockquote></div><br class=""></div></body></html>